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Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

Last post 07-26-2008 7:04 PM by CheeseCityFan. 16 replies.
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  • 07-25-2008 12:59 AM

    Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    I been a Packers fan and share holder for 41 years. I seen some sad ass Packers teams in the 70's and 80's. I think some of you fans should remember how bad the Packers were before Favre. Maybe some of you were not even born yet. I am a Packer Backer--that is what we were called in the Lombardi days...I am not a Cheesehead-never liked the name as for a fan--sounds too corny....My name is on one of those bricks on the 2nd level of Lambeau Field...Packer Backer 1967.  I read all the opinions of everyone...now I have mine.....Not once has anyone mentioned in the Favre Debate....how bad the DEFENSE  was in some of those playoff games that Favre so-called lost...like last year against the Giants--How many sacks-turnovers-pressures? The Packers scored 20 points and the defense couldn't hold the Giants to under that-How about that Eagles game? 4th and 26-oh it was Favre's fault he didn't intercept McNab...the 49er's game in 1999- T.O. with a touchdown catch with 3 seconds left...The Broncos in Super Bowl 32...the defense can't hold Terrell Davis...even the NFC Championship in 1996 against the Cowboys..the Packers scored 27 points and were winning in the 4th Quarter but could the Defense at least create a turnover-sack-hold Emmitt Smith--NO!! The Defense has failed the Packers more than Favre has in the Playoffs..yes he had some bad games...but not every playoff loss should Favre be blamed for. I like that Favre is standing up to Management...too much power is given to people in those positions and that includes the workforce we live in. How about some of you who work for a living? Would you like it if Management treated you like crap? After you have given 16 years of blood and guts and never missed a day of work. That's what Favre gave...and don't forget...he gives more money to charities each year in Wisconsin than some of you make in several years salary...so remember one day...if the Packers are having back to back losing seasons...that with Favre...the Packers only had ONE...in 16 years...how spoiled some of you fans have become!

  • 07-25-2008 1:18 AM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    PackerBacker1967:

    I been a Packers fan and share holder for 41 years. I seen some sad ass Packers teams in the 70's and 80's. I think some of you fans should remember how bad the Packers were before Favre. Maybe some of you were not even born yet. I am a Packer Backer--that is what we were called in the Lombardi days...I am not a Cheesehead-never liked the name as for a fan--sounds too corny....My name is on one of those bricks on the 2nd level of Lambeau Field...Packer Backer 1967.  I read all the opinions of everyone...now I have mine.....Not once has anyone mentioned in the Favre Debate....how bad the DEFENSE  was in some of those playoff games that Favre so-called lost...like last year against the Giants--How many sacks-turnovers-pressures? The Packers scored 20 points and the defense couldn't hold the Giants to under that-How about that Eagles game? 4th and 26-oh it was Favre's fault he didn't intercept McNab...the 49er's game in 1999- T.O. with a touchdown catch with 3 seconds left...The Broncos in Super Bowl 32...the defense can't hold Terrell Davis...even the NFC Championship in 1996 against the Cowboys..the Packers scored 27 points and were winning in the 4th Quarter but could the Defense at least create a turnover-sack-hold Emmitt Smith--NO!! The Defense has failed the Packers more than Favre has in the Playoffs..yes he had some bad games...but not every playoff loss should Favre be blamed for. I like that Favre is standing up to Management...too much power is given to people in those positions and that includes the workforce we live in. How about some of you who work for a living? Would you like it if Management treated you like crap? After you have given 16 years of blood and guts and never missed a day of work. That's what Favre gave...and don't forget...he gives more money to charities each year in Wisconsin than some of you make in several years salary...so remember one day...if the Packers are having back to back losing seasons...that with Favre...the Packers only had ONE...in 16 years...how spoiled some of you fans have become!

    Alright I'm game for this challenge....

    I'll grant you coaching or defense for a few of the games you mentioned;

    1.) The Super Bowl loss is on Holmgren! Why he decided to stop running the ball in the second half with Dorsey Levens is just awful playcalling/coaching. He put too much pressure on Favre to be perfect in that game and his play call at the end of that game was a play that the team NEVER RAN DURING THE SEASON!! That game's on Holmgren! (Holmgren let Davis score at the end to give the Packers a chance to comeback.)

    2.) The 49er's T.O. game still haunts me to this day. Why Holmgren played or any coach plays a "soft" prevent defense is beyond me!

    3.) The Philly game is ON MIKE SHERMAN!!! I'll hold a grudge against that man for the rest of my life because HE lost that game NOT FAVRE... Sure Brett threw that stupid INT, but the Packers NEVER should've been in that position in the first place!

    4.) The Giants game wasn't entirely Favre's fault but, he did the team no favors with his play. His careless "duck" INT he threw that NY fumbled and Tauscher recovered was one of the DUMBEST PASSES in a Big Game by a H.O.F'er that I'VE EVER SEEN!! The Giants outplayed and outcoached the Packers in the NFC Title Game. Team loss there plain and simple.

    However you don't seem to mention Favre's two WORST performances;

    1.) St. Louis in '01? 6 INT's is just UNFORGIVEABLE and almost completely on Favre, even though a few passes were tipped!

    2.) Minnesota in '04? Favre threw 4 INT's against a terrible Vikes team and is most remembered in this game for throwing an underhanded pass 5 yards past the line of scrimmage. Favre played terrible in this game, regardless if the Packers defense didn't stop the Vikings.

     Lastly... The 70's and 80's WILL NOT RETURN now that Favre's gone. TT and MM are TOO GOOD at what they do and the landscape of the NFL just simply WON'T ALLOW a team to be that obscure and terrible for that long. And don't use the Arizona Cardinals as an example, they have terrible front office personnel. The Packers don't! The Packers WILL BE FINE!!!

    BANK ON IT!!
  • 07-25-2008 1:44 AM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    Yes I know Favre had those bad games against the Rams and Vikes...I did say he had some bad games in the playoffs....Point Taken...good observation on the games I mentioned....but really...since Favre...The Packers offense was always better than their defense...even with Reggie White...I think McCarthy is a great coach-underrated...he wants the Packers to be like the Steelers Defense of the 70's-kick ass-in your face...I am from Pittsburgh-and just recently moved back to the Burgh...and though I was a Packers fan...I had to watch the Steelers because they didn't show anybody else...that was before NFL GAMEDAY..even today...The Steelers are known for their defense..fast-blitzing-hard hitting...I hope McCarthy can come even close to that...that is what will win the next Championship for the Packers!

  • 07-25-2008 3:41 AM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    PackerBacker1967:

    Yes I know Favre had those bad games against the Rams and Vikes...I did say he had some bad games in the playoffs....Point Taken...good observation on the games I mentioned....but really...since Favre...The Packers offense was always better than their defense...even with Reggie White...I think McCarthy is a great coach-underrated...he wants the Packers to be like the Steelers Defense of the 70's-kick ass-in your face...I am from Pittsburgh-and just recently moved back to the Burgh...and though I was a Packers fan...I had to watch the Steelers because they didn't show anybody else...that was before NFL GAMEDAY..even today...The Steelers are known for their defense..fast-blitzing-hard hitting...I hope McCarthy can come even close to that...that is what will win the next Championship for the Packers!

    This link might answer any questions or reservations that you may have about the Packers Defense this upcoming season.

    http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=762740

    BANK ON IT!!
  • 07-26-2008 6:58 AM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    Favre brought fame to the Packers and has been  very charitable to Wisconsin.  And Wisconsinities were very supportive to Favre through his pain killer drug addiction and his wife's cancer.  However, these are not the issues we are facing.  The issue on hand is whether or not Brett is going to return to professional football.  He is under contract with the Packers and you would think that all the praise and support given to Favre he would want to return to Green Bay where people supported him.  Through the years if Favre wasnt playing up to par it was because the defense wasnt any good, his shoulder was bothering him, or his hand hurts.  What Favre and the fans need to realize is the Packers are a team.  The GB Packers doesnt consist of just Brett Favre.  Saying this doesnt Brett Favre feel that Rodgers should have a chance to play also.   Right now we have team players that are saying Let's go forward with or without Favre.  I think that is wonderful, they are showing that they are willing to play and will give their all. If you cant stand behind the team, you have no business being a shareholder!  Take your money out and go spend time with Favre as he enjoy's his retirement.     

  • 07-26-2008 7:05 AM In reply to

    • MuddyMask
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 07-17-2008
    • Southern Dane County
    • Posts 730

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    LOUANNE:

    Favre brought fame to the Packers and has been  very charitable to Wisconsin.  And Wisconsinities were very supportive to Favre through his pain killer drug addiction and his wife's cancer.  However, these are not the issues we are facing.  The issue on hand is whether or not Brett is going to return to professional football.  He is under contract with the Packers and you would think that all the praise and support given to Favre he would want to return to Green Bay where people supported him.  Through the years if Favre wasnt playing up to par it was because the defense wasnt any good, his shoulder was bothering him, or his hand hurts.  What Favre and the fans need to realize is the Packers are a team.  The GB Packers doesnt consist of just Brett Favre.  Saying this doesnt Brett Favre feel that Rodgers should have a chance to play also.   Right now we have team players that are saying Let's go forward with or without Favre.  I think that is wonderful, they are showing that they are willing to play and will give their all.       

     

    You are right to focus on the team. 

    "What more could be fairer." - Joseph "Roundy" Coughlin
  • 07-26-2008 9:45 AM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    PackerBacker1967:

    I been a Packers fan and share holder for 41 years. I seen some sad ass Packers teams in the 70's and 80's. I think some of you fans should remember how bad the Packers were before Favre. Maybe some of you were not even born yet. I am a Packer Backer--that is what we were called in the Lombardi days...I am not a Cheesehead-never liked the name as for a fan--sounds too corny....My name is on one of those bricks on the 2nd level of Lambeau Field...Packer Backer 1967.  I read all the opinions of everyone...now I have mine.....Not once has anyone mentioned in the Favre Debate....how bad the DEFENSE  was in some of those playoff games that Favre so-called lost...like last year against the Giants--How many sacks-turnovers-pressures? The Packers scored 20 points and the defense couldn't hold the Giants to under that-How about that Eagles game? 4th and 26-oh it was Favre's fault he didn't intercept McNab...the 49er's game in 1999- T.O. with a touchdown catch with 3 seconds left...The Broncos in Super Bowl 32...the defense can't hold Terrell Davis...even the NFC Championship in 1996 against the Cowboys..the Packers scored 27 points and were winning in the 4th Quarter but could the Defense at least create a turnover-sack-hold Emmitt Smith--NO!! The Defense has failed the Packers more than Favre has in the Playoffs..yes he had some bad games...but not every playoff loss should Favre be blamed for. I like that Favre is standing up to Management...too much power is given to people in those positions and that includes the workforce we live in. How about some of you who work for a living? Would you like it if Management treated you like crap? After you have given 16 years of blood and guts and never missed a day of work. That's what Favre gave...and don't forget...he gives more money to charities each year in Wisconsin than some of you make in several years salary...so remember one day...if the Packers are having back to back losing seasons...that with Favre...the Packers only had ONE...in 16 years...how spoiled some of you fans have become!

    PackerBacker, I respect your opinion but I have to disagree on some of your points.  First, peple aren't blaming Brett for the TO game or the SB loss.  The problem I have with his playoff games specifically: 1. Rams: 6 int's.  He never gave the defense a chance to play bad. 2. The egg's he laid against Minn and Atl at home in the playoffs.  3. 4th and 26. You're right the defense failed but the ball was in the hands of our HOF qb and when he felt the rush he threw a duck straight up in the air that looked more like something Rich Campbell would have thrown....I can't recall Montana ever doing something like that in a critical situation. 4. I don't think we need to rehash that last pass against the Giants.  All you need look at is the picture.

    As far as Management treating him like crap?  Please, he retired and all they've done is kiss his a$$ for the past 5 years.  Don't forget he walks away from the game with more money than he'll be able to spend in a life time and before you start giving out guilt trips on charity remember, it's not how much you give but what percentage of your income you give.  Favre giving 50 grand to a charity in GB is like me buying a 10 dollar raffel ticket..Whooopiee...  As far as fans being spoiled you may be right.  I actually think we're smarter.  Look at all the dopes back in the 70's that wanted to hang on to all the old has been's from the SB years.  These fans know the ultimate goal is to win the SB, not have winning seasons.  Brett is no longer capable of winning the SB.  Who knows if Rodgers is but lets give him a chance.  And by the way, if you want to put some blame here put it on the CBA and not on TT.  If we didn't have free agency Brett could play as long as he wanted and Rogers would have no recourse but to sit on the bench and like it.  With the CBA we stand to lose a first round draft choice who has flashed considerable talent if we continue to put a 38 y/o qb behind center.

    “It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him.” J.R.R. Tolkien
  • 07-26-2008 1:12 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

     to Packer Backer1967,

     

        You sir, are a man that gets it.  Welcome to the forum.  Nice to have someone else with a little objectivity here.  You are absolutely right on all your points. I would like to add a few notes as well.

         To take them in chronological order,  The Super Bowl loss to Denver had everything to do with not being able to stop Terell Davis.  And if you all remember he sat out nearly the entire 2nd Quarter with migraines.  Although when you can't get off the field on third down it is typically your own fault, the defense was gassed.  The PACKERS were lucky enough to have a chance to tie the game in the end.  And mostly is was because of Levens good running in the first half, and Favre who brought them back with a lead going into the 4th Quarter.   And on that last drive, where granted he threw a pass into danger as Brooks was nearly decapitated by Atwater, he also hit Freeman in stride that he flat out dropped.  In Denver territory, though of course we needed a TD just to tie. 

         The game vs SF should have been won when Jerry Rice fumbled and they gave the ball back to the 49'ers.  That was it.  Game over, Packers could have run out the clock, instead Young gets one last no pressure prevent defense, stumbles and throws the ball between three defenders to TO. 

         I believe it was San Fransisco again, that oh, by the way we won 25-15.  Then it was congratulations, you get to play the Rams.

        Even in the Rams game before what is known as Favre's follies, we were driving to take the lead at half when Freeman coughs it up down the sideline and turns into a 14 point swing. 7 we didn't get and 7 they did.   Favre then played poorly and gave the Rams many short fields to score.

       What was next, Atlanta I think.  A game that was the perfect storm for the Falcons.  A combination of Favre not playing his best, a decimated roster of injuries and the x-factor.  Not having a game plan to stop Michael Vick.  He didn't even have to throw the ball and gain over 100 yards on the ground extending drives.

        For whatever reason, Favre always seems to get the blame for the Philly game in Philadelphia, though it was probably one of his finest performances in the post season.  The game was won.  Favre made great throws to Ferguson for 2 early scores.  Up 17-14 and with only a minute to go driving for what could have become a Sherman highlight.  Green thrashing the defense for over 4 yards a carry and picking up every short yardage first down, is not given the chance to WIN the game with 1:51 on the clock at the Eagles 40 yard line.  4th and 1.   A chance to quiet the critics, TAKE the victory and earn a game vs Carolina back at Lambeau Field.  Sherman decided to punt!  And by doing so give the Eagles a chance that they didn't deserve.  Remember the look of Andy Reid's face, when he knew one more yard and GAME OVER.  Even if it was the "right" thing to do, it was gutless.  You play like a champion, you line up and get that yard, and if you don't.  You send out your defense to stop the other team.  What did they gain 20 yards of field position?   People that put that game on Favre, don't understand football. 

          The final heave as it were, was mis communication between Favre and Walker, Walker broke to the inside instead of the outside making it an easy play for Dawkins sitting back in center field.  

       The Minnesota game just made no sense.  After beating them twice during the year.  I think they were all a little too overconfident.  The four interceptions were all very bad whether there was communication loss of not.  Favre played a horrible game, worst one ever in my opinion. 

      The Seattle games were great.  Although our defense played poorly in the first one in 2004, and they dropped as many passes as they caught.  The seahawks really should have won that game.  But, the in the game, our offensive side of the ball was great, and Harris pick gave the defense a little validation making a big time play when we needed one.

        last year's game vs Seattle was vintage Favre. Down early 14-0, no panic.  Just 5 straight drives of scoring TD's.  Favre was in tune with his receivers and Grant played fanastic after his early miscues.  Defense also were relentless. With all cylinders clicking, they thought the Giants game was a mere formality.

        For anyone to say that Favre cost us that game again is fullfilling their own prophecies.  The team played like crap.  After playing their best a week earlier, they looked like a bottom feeder team rather than a Super Bowl contender.  From the coaches inabiltiy to call a good game, to let Manning get comfortable in the pocket and not have to deal with any kind of pressure, to the defensive coordinator's  stubborness to not react to the situations (Burress torching Harris) and make adjustments, to no push off the line, to mental mistakes by quarteback and receivers, to poor play of special teams, and to guys making it worse by committing stupid penalties.  and yet, we have the lead with half the 4th quarter to go. Up 20-17, all we need is the defense to step up and make a stop and let Grant run out the clock. 

  • 07-26-2008 2:01 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    azpackfan04:

      To take them in chronological order,  The Super Bowl loss to Denver had everything to do with not being able to stop Terell Davis.  And if you all remember he sat out nearly the entire 2nd Quarter with migraines.  Although when you can't get off the field on third down it is typically your own fault, the defense was gassed.  The PACKERS were lucky enough to have a chance to tie the game in the end.  And mostly is was because of Levens good running in the first half, and Favre who brought them back with a lead going into the 4th Quarter.   And on that last drive, where granted he threw a pass into danger as Brooks was nearly decapitated by Atwater, he also hit Freeman in stride that he flat out dropped.  In Denver territory, though of course we needed a TD just to tie. 

         The game vs SF should have been won when Jerry Rice fumbled and they gave the ball back to the 49'ers.  That was it.  Game over, Packers could have run out the clock, instead Young gets one last no pressure prevent defense, stumbles and throws the ball between three defenders to TO. 

         I

    show me the post where he was blamed for those two losses...
    “It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him.” J.R.R. Tolkien
  • 07-26-2008 2:09 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    ptisme:

    azpackfan04:

      To take them in chronological order,  The Super Bowl loss to Denver had everything to do with not being able to stop Terell Davis.  And if you all remember he sat out nearly the entire 2nd Quarter with migraines.  Although when you can't get off the field on third down it is typically your own fault, the defense was gassed.  The PACKERS were lucky enough to have a chance to tie the game in the end.  And mostly is was because of Levens good running in the first half, and Favre who brought them back with a lead going into the 4th Quarter.   And on that last drive, where granted he threw a pass into danger as Brooks was nearly decapitated by Atwater, he also hit Freeman in stride that he flat out dropped.  In Denver territory, though of course we needed a TD just to tie. 

         The game vs SF should have been won when Jerry Rice fumbled and they gave the ball back to the 49'ers.  That was it.  Game over, Packers could have run out the clock, instead Young gets one last no pressure prevent defense, stumbles and throws the ball between three defenders to TO. 

         I

    show me the post where he was blamed for those two losses...

    BF was responsible for two turnovers (a fumble and an INT) that led to 10 Bronco points in SB XXXII.  Part of that was on Holmy, who should have known that Denver would throw the kitchen sink since they couldn't stop anyone by conventional matters, and who abandoned the run attack.  Of course, we all know why Holmy's head was up his hind quarters that week...

    I shave with Occam's Razor
  • 07-26-2008 2:25 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    Loaane the only so called team players that say they want to move on without Brett Favre and Ted Thompson and Mark Murpy. No current Packer player has said they would prefer Brett not come back. However many Packer players have said they would like to see Brett back. Please check your facts before you make a statement like that.

  • 07-26-2008 2:25 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    This is very well said from a true loyal Packer Fan.

  • 07-26-2008 5:10 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    CheeseCityFan:

    ptisme:

    azpackfan04:

      To take them in chronological order,  The Super Bowl loss to Denver had everything to do with not being able to stop Terell Davis.  And if you all remember he sat out nearly the entire 2nd Quarter with migraines.  Although when you can't get off the field on third down it is typically your own fault, the defense was gassed.  The PACKERS were lucky enough to have a chance to tie the game in the end.  And mostly is was because of Levens good running in the first half, and Favre who brought them back with a lead going into the 4th Quarter.   And on that last drive, where granted he threw a pass into danger as Brooks was nearly decapitated by Atwater, he also hit Freeman in stride that he flat out dropped.  In Denver territory, though of course we needed a TD just to tie. 

         The game vs SF should have been won when Jerry Rice fumbled and they gave the ball back to the 49'ers.  That was it.  Game over, Packers could have run out the clock, instead Young gets one last no pressure prevent defense, stumbles and throws the ball between three defenders to TO. 

         I

    show me the post where he was blamed for those two losses...

    BF was responsible for two turnovers (a fumble and an INT) that led to 10 Bronco points in SB XXXII.  Part of that was on Holmy, who should have known that Denver would throw the kitchen sink since they couldn't stop anyone by conventional matters, and who abandoned the run attack.  Of course, we all know why Holmy's head was up his hind quarters that week...

    I agree but I don't put blame for those two losses directly on BF like I do on: Philly, St. Louis and NYG for instance...
    “It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him.” J.R.R. Tolkien
  • 07-26-2008 5:28 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

    Hey Ace Maverick

    You need to read time out on the 2nd page

  • 07-26-2008 5:35 PM In reply to

    Re: Too much HATE in Packer Nation--How sad!

     

    Its only a game.........and KMA if you dont like it!
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