Brewers Message Board

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

The_Igniter — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 14:53:39 GMT

mikeyjay21:
What is this? An "I told you so"?

No just updating. I didn't say I was right you are wrong. I didn't say the results are in. I said the early results are in. Things can easily change although McClung might not get the chance to stick in the starting rotation. That doesn''t mean that Burns can't fall on his face.

mikeyjay21:

My point was always that it made sense to give McClung the first shot at the open rotation spot. I don't care what's happened in his first two starts; the fact of the matter was he successfully made the move last year, and I didn't think it'd be smart to try a revolving door of untested AAA pitchers that scouts aren't high on just because they're having a good year in Nashville.

And again I think you are making to much of the jump between AAA and the majors and not enough of the jump from reliever to starter midseason. Mike Burns, the ultimate example of the untested AAA pitchers that scouts aren't high on having a good year in Nashville, is performing admirably as the starter.

mikeyjay21:
Now I'm fine with trying something else. But I don't know why you felt the need to call me out here. I still think your method of finding a "fix" to the rotation would've been more reckless than the reasonable one that Macha and the oganization eventually took.

I am just keeping the discussion open. The fact of the matter is over the first 2 starts the more reckless approach has 12.1 innings and a 4.36 ERA and the more reasonable approach has a 12+ ERA in 4 innings or less per start. So you can label them any way you want but the fact of the matter is the reckless approach is soon to have 2 people in the starting rotation while the reasonable approach is failing miserably.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

mikeyjay21 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 19:39:15 GMT

The_Igniter:
It would be nice to know where the Brewers would be sitting with Chase Wright in the starting rotation instead of McClung in these 4 starts.

Given his weak stuff and inconsistent command, I'm guessing Wright would've been hit harder.

His 3.70 ERA in Nashville sure does look nice, but his 1.44 WHIP would likely be higher in the majors, meaning more walks and more hits (and less strikeouts, not that he strikes guys out a lot anyway). I see no reason to think Wright would be a better bet to last 5+ innings in a major league start beyond the fact that his AAA bubble gum stats look good this year.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

mikeyjay21 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 19:27:45 GMT

The_Igniter:
Wisblue & Mikeyjay.

The early results are in and although the overall record for these two are the same (1-1) how they have pitched is entirely different.

Burns has 12.1 innings in two starts and a 4.39 ERA. His first start could have been won but McClung's replacement gave up 2 runs in a third of an inning in what ended up being a 2 run game.

On the other hand, McClung has a 12.27 ERA in 7.1 innings and two starts. He has really taxed the Bullpen, especially without him in there to eat some innings.

It would be nice to know where the Brewers would be sitting with Chase Wright in the starting rotation instead of McClung in these 4 starts.

What is this? An "I told you so"?

My point was always that it made sense to give McClung the first shot at the open rotation spot. I don't care what's happened in his first two starts; the fact of the matter was he successfully made the move last year, and I didn't think it'd be smart to try a revolving door of untested AAA pitchers that scouts aren't high on just because they're having a good year in Nashville.

Now I'm fine with trying something else. But I don't know why you felt the need to call me out here. I still think your method of finding a "fix" to the rotation would've been more reckless than the reasonable one that Macha and the oganization eventually took.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

The_Igniter — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 17:02:43 GMT

BrewerFanatic:
I live in East Tennessee about 3 hours from Nashville. Actually live near Tennessee Smokies Cubs AA team. Been trying to get to the Huntsville games. Probably going tonight. I'll try to take some pictures

Nice. Do you get any of the minor league teams/games on TV? I am not really up to date on the TV situation or range of Minor League teams. I know the Wisconsin T-Rats (Appleton A ball club) has a couple of games on time warner cable but I think a big reason for that is Time Warner sponsors the field and is a big sponsor of the club. If you do you would probably have the most knowledge of these minor leaguers of anybody on the board. Basically all I know of any prospect is scouting reports and stats but that sometimes does not tell the whole story.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

BrewerFanatic — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 16:49:05 GMT

The_Igniter:

BrewerFanatic:
Nashville's rotation has been a little hard to figure. I'm going to Saturday's Nashville game and still don't know who the SP will be. I'll be wearing my Manny Parra shirt though; gotta get some use out of it

Do you live down there?

It would be cool if you took a couple pictures and posted them on the board and gave us a first hand update on the Nashville Sounds.

I live in East Tennessee about 3 hours from Nashville. Actually live near Tennessee Smokies Cubs AA team. Been trying to get to the Huntsville games. Probably going tonight. I'll try to take some pictures but am a little inept at posting.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

The_Igniter — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:51:06 GMT

BrewerFanatic:
Nashville's rotation has been a little hard to figure. I'm going to Saturday's Nashville game and still don't know who the SP will be. I'll be wearing my Manny Parra shirt though; gotta get some use out of it

Do you live down there?

It would be cool if you took a couple pictures and posted them on the board and gave us a first hand update on the Nashville Sounds.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

The_Igniter — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:41:24 GMT

largetree:
True, but I thought that is why they sent Dillard down to be a starter...to get stretched out and work on the marathon part of being a pitcher which means developing a repitoire of pitches so the 2nd or 3rd time through the line-up you're still effective.

Yeah I wouldn't mind Dillard coming up. It was just I thought that he was struggling and haven't really paid attention to him on the last 2-4 starts. As for the reliever part I had him on my mind and he was a good example in my opinion.

Dillard or Wright would be fine choices at this point. Get McClung back in the pen and send Naverson back down.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

brewerfanx1 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:37:12 GMT

I like the idea of brining up Dillard to start. Mainly because he throws a sinker.

Here is a very interesting article on Tim Dillard from the Nashville Sounds dated 6/18/09,

http://www.nashvillesounds.com/news/news.asp?newsId=3040

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

largetree — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:34:12 GMT

My last comment on this thread is MKE needs to bring up anybody other than Manny. MP needs to spend a couple months in AAA and earn his way back to the bigs. If he gets hungry enough and starts pitching like it then MP has value, otherwise he's just a pampered cry baby which is useless to MKE.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

largetree — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:26:26 GMT

The_Igniter:

largetree:
Why not bring up Dillard...he has been pitching good except for one outing, he pitched in MKE last year and seems to go between 6-7ip each outing.

I was about to say he isn't pitching as good as Wright but I looked at the stats again and he has rolled off two straight incredible starts where he pitched a total of 16 innings and allowed a total of 3 ER to lower his ERA dramatically. He could be sniffing the majors with the Bush injury.

largetree:
Seth must get psyched out being a starting pitcher because as a reliver he's not too bad.

I don't think it is psyched out. I think it has more to do with the amount of pitches expected to throw, seeing guys 2-3 times instead of once, and conserving energy. A starter is expected to be more of a Marathon runner where a reliever is more of a sprinter.

Dillard would be a perfect example of this. In the minors he always started and nobody thought he was anything special. Then he gets the call to Milwaukee to help the bullpen out and he is sporting a mid-90's fastball. Everyone is wondering where the hell did that come from. Over an inning he can ramp it up to mid 90's but a start he can't maintain that velocity.

True, but I thought that is why they sent Dillard down to be a starter...to get stretched out and work on the marathon part of being a pitcher which means developing a repitoire of pitches so the 2nd or 3rd time through the line-up you're still effective. Anyway, I would like to see him or Chase or both given a chance...its obvious Seth isn't the answer and he should be back to the pen before his confidence is shot (like Manny P) and then the problem just gets worse.

Also, most the guys brought up from AAA have done well (smith, burns, defilice), execpt narverson so I'm thinking either Chase or TD could work out.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

The_Igniter — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:20:06 GMT

largetree:
Why not bring up Dillard...he has been pitching good except for one outing, he pitched in MKE last year and seems to go between 6-7ip each outing.

I was about to say he isn't pitching as good as Wright but I looked at the stats again and he has rolled off two straight incredible starts where he pitched a total of 16 innings and allowed a total of 3 ER to lower his ERA dramatically. He could be sniffing the majors with the Bush injury.

largetree:
Seth must get psyched out being a starting pitcher because as a reliver he's not too bad.

I don't think it is psyched out. I think it has more to do with the amount of pitches expected to throw, seeing guys 2-3 times instead of once, and conserving energy. A starter is expected to be more of a Marathon runner where a reliever is more of a sprinter.

Dillard would be a perfect example of this. In the minors he always started and nobody thought he was anything special. Then he gets the call to Milwaukee to help the bullpen out and he is sporting a mid-90's fastball. Everyone is wondering where the hell did that come from. Over an inning he can ramp it up to mid 90's but a start he can't maintain that velocity.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

BrewerFanatic — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:15:58 GMT

largetree:

BrewerFanatic:

The_Igniter:

Daubs:
McClung might not even make his next start....

Well Wright did not make his scheduled start last night for the Sounds. I have no idea why. Even if he was going to replace McClung you would think he would have pitched last night.

Nashville's rotation has been a little hard to figure. I'm going to Saturday's Nashville game and still don't know who the SP will be. I'll be wearing my Manny Parra shirt though; gotta get some use out of it

Why not bring up Dillard...he has been pitching good except for one outing, he pitched in MKE last year and seems to go between 6-7ip each outing. Maybe another Looper type of pitcher but at least he keeps you in the game and eats some innings plus Seth can go back to the pen.

Seth must get psyched out being a starting pitcher because as a reliver he's not too bad.

+1. And send down Narveson and bring up Wright too. Unless Bush is coming off the DL soon.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

largetree — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:00:33 GMT

BrewerFanatic:

The_Igniter:

Daubs:
McClung might not even make his next start....

Well Wright did not make his scheduled start last night for the Sounds. I have no idea why. Even if he was going to replace McClung you would think he would have pitched last night.

Nashville's rotation has been a little hard to figure. I'm going to Saturday's Nashville game and still don't know who the SP will be. I'll be wearing my Manny Parra shirt though; gotta get some use out of it

Why not bring up Dillard...he has been pitching good except for one outing, he pitched in MKE last year and seems to go between 6-7ip each outing. Maybe another Looper type of pitcher but at least he keeps you in the game and eats some innings plus Seth can go back to the pen.

Seth must get psyched out being a starting pitcher because as a reliver he's not too bad.

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

BrewerFanatic — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 14:52:49 GMT

The_Igniter:

Daubs:
McClung might not even make his next start....

Well Wright did not make his scheduled start last night for the Sounds. I have no idea why. Even if he was going to replace McClung you would think he would have pitched last night.

Nashville's rotation has been a little hard to figure. I'm going to Saturday's Nashville game and still don't know who the SP will be. I'll be wearing my Manny Parra shirt though; gotta get some use out of it

Re: Bush to DL, Burns recalled

brewerfanx1 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 14:25:32 GMT

The_Igniter:
That creates a huge hole.

Why fill a hole only to create a new one? Not very logical.